[qadianism] Re: [Fwd: Qadianism]
By aa3 @axe.humboldt.edu

How can you judge unbiasedly if you have not agreed on the interpretation of
'khatam an nabiyyeen'. If you think your interpretation is correct then
there is no basis for talking about Hazrat Mirza Sahib (AS). However, if you
accept that 'khatam an nabiyyeen' does not prohibit the coming of a non-law
bearing prophet then you can discuss if Mirza Sahib is a prophet or not.

>There has been more than enough discussion about the FINALITY OF
>Now, please leave that topic.
>This forum is about qadianism not khatme nabuwwat, so please only check
>that if Mirza Ghulam Ahmed is RIGHT IN HIS ARGUMENTS.
>I would request Ahmadi's and non-ahmadis to just ponder on this article
>and try to give it's answer as quick as possible or atleast mention if
>they have it or not.
> According to Mirza Sahib:
>                          a) Jesus(ph) died in 120 A.D.(see ref. 1)
>                          b) Jesus was worshipped as God or Son of
>                             God after Jesus died. Even SEED SOWING of
>                             this association with God was done after
>                             death of Jesus. (see ref. 2)
>                          c) SEED SOWING of association was done by
>                             St. Paul. (see ref. 3)
>                            "OBJECTION"
>St. Paul died around '65' A.D. Therefore, Jesus(ph) was made son of God
>by St. Paul atleast '55' years (120-65=3D55) before the death of Jesus(ph)
>(See ref. 4)
>                                LAST PROPHET
>                                ------------=20
>When Qadianis discuss with me, they love to discuss on Khatme Nabuwwat .
>I tell them frankly that  by discussing on Khatme Nabuwwat they want to
>prove only  that Mirza is a true prophet.
>I tell them  quite openly that ONLY FOR THE PURPOSE OF DISCUSSION let us
>believe that not one but 3000 more true prophets are to come. But if
>4000 prophets come 1000 will be false. Mirza is among the 3000 or 1000.
>There was no Khatme Nabuwwat issue in the time of Moses(ph) and
>Jesus(ph). When any one claimed to be the Nabi, the deciding factor
>was:  Is he truly right guided or not  ? MIRZA IS NOT !!!
>See Quran Majeed Ayat 36/21 : Follow those who ask not of you any hire
>and are (themselves rightly) guided.
>According to the above arguments Mirza Saheb is not rightly guided and
>therefore should not be followed in the light of Qura'n Majeed.=20
>1)  "Hence, I shall prove in this book that Jesus (Peace be upon him)
>did not die on the Cross neither did he go up to the Heavens nor it
>should ever be hoped that he will return to the earth from the Heavens;=20
>rather, he died at the age of 120 years in Srinagar in Kashmir, and his
>grave is in the Khanyar Region of Srinagar." =20
>(Maseeh Hindustan Mein, (Jesus in India) Roohani Khazain vol.15 p.14)
>2)  "The Holy Quran clearly says that the Masih was lifted to the
>heavens after his death.  Therefore his descent is symbolic and not
>real.  And in the verse 'Falamma Tawaffeteni' it has been clearly
>manifested that death of Hazrat Isa (pbuh) has already taken place.=20
>Because the meaning of the verse is that the Christians will go astray
>after the death of Hazrat Isa (pbuh) and not during his lifetime.  So if
>we assume that Hazrat Isa (pbuh) is not yet dead, then we will have to
>agree that the Christians are not yet digressed, and this is absolutely
>false.  Rather the verse is saying that the Christians remained faithful
>only until the life-time of Hazrat Isa (pbuh).  From this it becomes
>known that corruption had already begun during the time of Disciples.=20
>If the period of the Disciples had been such that the Christians had
>still been on right path, then in this verse Allah would not have linked
>it with the life-time of Hazrat Isa (pbuh) only, but would have included
>the life time of the disciples as well.  Thus at this juncture a very
>good point of the period of corruption in Christianity is illustrated
>and which is that IN TRUTH, during the time of the Disciples themselves,
>the SEEDS OF SHIRK (associating partner with God) were sown in
>Christianity." =20
>(Anjam-e-Atham, Roohani Khazain vol. 11 p.321)
>3)  "All the bad things were introduced in this religion (Christianity)
>by Paul.  Hazrat Isa was such an unselfish person that He did not even
>want anyone to call him a pious man but Paul made him God."
>(Chasma-e-Maseehi, Roohani Khazain vol. 20 p.375)
> "And in the very first instance, he (Paul) implanted the bad seedling
>of Trinity in Damascus.  And this Pauline Trinity started from
>Damascus.  It is towards this that Hadith Shareef has hinted that the
>future Maseeh will descend on the eastern side of Damascus."
>(Chasma-e-Maseehi, Roohani Khazain vol. 20 p.377)
>4)  In this book, Chasma-e-Maseehi, Mirza Sahib has clearly stated that
>St. Paul was responsible for the doctrine of Holy Trinity and thus
>turning Hazrat Isa into God.  It is a well known fact that St. Paul died
>in 64 AD or 67 AD. The book 'The 100' gives the year of his death as 64
>AD.  Encyclopaedia of Religion and Ethics says:
>"That he suffered martyrdom at Rome there can be no doubt=85the date will
>lie between A.D. 64 and 67, most probably nearer the former than the
>later limit."=20
>(Encyclopaedia vol. 9 p.694)

Abdul Aziz
School of Business & Economics
Humboldt State University

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