[qadianism] Re: I need some answers
By Suheil Laher @alum.mit.edu
2:08pm
Mon
22
Feb

Farhan Qureshi wrote:

> "The Messiah son of Mary is only a Messenger: Surley messengers like
> him have passed away before him. And his mother was a truthful woman.
> They both USED to eat food. See how We explain the Signs of Allah for
> their good, and see how they are turned away." (5:75)
>
> If you read the Arabic, and the and transalation, you will see that
> eating food is used in the past tense!!! Thus they no longer eat
> food!!!!!!!! Explain this. PLEASE EXPLAIN.

Farhan,

You are jumping to shaky conclusions.

Yes, the verse says they used to eat food in the (maaDi istimraari
form). But, this does not imply that they no longer eat food.  The
verse is emphasizing to people that Jesus and Mary (peace be upon 
them both) are human beings.  Hence, it is only reasonable to draw
attention to their worldly lives, which were witnessed by people:
i.e. they used to eat food while they were on the earth.  This 
gives no clear indication of whether they eat now or not.  It 
could be that both of them still eat, or neither of them do, or
one of them does and the other doesn't.  Since I cannot think of
any hadith which specifies whether or not they eat now, I would 
not make a firm statement either way.

Mariam (peace be upon her) has died, and people do not usually eat
after they have died - although that does not rule out a karamah, 
as occurs with the martyrs (shuhadaa') of the battlefield as 
mentioned in Qur'an [3:169]. Although we do not believe that 
Jesus (peace be upon him) has died yet, his life in the heavens
need not necessarily be the same as worldly life; i.e. he may not
need to eat there, or he may receive nutrition without eating, as
occurred with Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings upon him) when
he used to fast continuously.

BTW, as a further fortification of the line of reasoning, look 
at Qur'an [28:53].  If you look only at the Arabic text and 
grammar, without considering the context, do you see any 
indication that the people are still Muslims, or just that they
were Muslims before the Qur'an came?  And yet, the context makes
it clear that they are still Muslims.  Similarly, for the verse
you cited, we must examine the context and other information
available.

And Allah is the Granter of Success.

- Suheil

> ---Rashid < rasye-@emirates.net.ae > wrote:
> >
> > Mr Farhan
> >
> > You keep repeating the same thing.
> >
> > > And Mr Rashid Ali please explain where you have gotton your
> > > informatrion from that Isa ibn Maryam eats in heaven, and he is still
> > > alive? Does he float??
> >
> > Are you trying to be funny Mr Farhan?For me the statement of Rasoolullah
> > SAAW is enough whereby He says that Eisa Ibne Maryam will descend from
> > Heavens. I do not ask how & why or what is he eating in heavens, whether he
> > is alive in heavens or dead or whether he floats. It was you or one of your
> > associates who asked what does he eats in heavens.
> >
> > > Anyhow my point is that Where does it say
> > > thatJesus 9as) is dead, you were never ever able to answer that
> > > question!!!
> >
> > Mr Farhan. I never said that he is dead. It is the belief of every Muslim,
> > from the time of Rasoolullah till today, that Hazrat Eisa AS ibne Maryam did
> > not die, nor was he crucified, he ascended to heavens and will return before
> > the last hour.
> >
> > > Unstead you just babled upon the statement that even if
> > > Isa ibn Maryam (as) was dead why cound not he live again: according to
> > > yourself he is still alive: prove you self in this statemen please!!!!!
> >
> > Farhan, there is no proof for me greater than the Hadith of Rasoolullah
> > SAAW. Rasoolullah said that Eisa ibne Maryam is going to come and I believe
> > Him. Whether Eisa AS is alive or dead, it doesn't concern me.
> >
> > Even your 'prophet' Mirza Ghulam used to believ the same thing:
> >
> > "... the prophecy regarding the coming of Maseeh AS is a first grade
> > prophecy which has been accepted unanimously. And among all the prophecies
> > in Sahah (the six authentic works of Hadith), none can match it....... Now
> > to discredit so much evidences and to say that all these are fabricated is
> > the work of those people who had not recieved any insight and knowledge of
> > what is right from God."
> > (Izala-e-Auham, Roohani Khazain vol 3 p.400)
> >
> > "....And Hazrat Maseeh (AS) will descend on the earth with great might and
> > will clean all the ways of dirt. There will not remain a trace of evil."
> > (Braheen-e-Ahmadiyya Part 4, Roohani Khazain, vol 1, p.593)
> >
> > However the with the passage of time, when he changed the nature of his
> > claims, his beliefs also changed. And the basis for such a change? His own
> > revelation, not Quran, not Hadith but his own waahi!
> >
> > "God has revealved to me in his special inspiration that Maseeh ibne Maryam
> > is dead."
> > (Tauzeeh-e-Maram, Roohani Khazain vol 3 p.402)
> >
> > And do you know why he claimed to be Messiah? Because it was Hakeem Nuruddin
> > who suggested to him:
> >
> > "Whatever you have written that if I leave aside the Hadith of Damascus
> > (about the coming of Messiah) and put forth the claim of Maseel Maseeh, then
> > what is the harm in it? I do not want to become Maseel  Maseeh...."
> > (Maktoobaat-e-Ahmadiyya vol 5 No. 2 p.85)
> >
> > However the temptation was too great to resist and ultimately he started
> > claiming to be Maseel Maseeh:
> >
> > "I have claimed to be Maseel Maseeh, which stupid people thinks that it is
> > Promised Messiah ..... I have never claimed to be the Messiah ibne Maryam.
> > Anyone who accuses me of it, he is absolutely a liar and fabricator. I have
> > been constantly announcing for the last eight years that i am Maseel Maseeh,
> > that is, Hazrat Eisa AS's certain spiritual properties and nature and habits
> > and virtues has been given to me as well by God AlMighty."
> (Izala-e-Auham,
> > Roohani Khazain vol 3 p.192)
> >
> > Note that Mirza is denying that he is the Promised Messiah in this
> > quotation. However once again he could not resist very long. he announced:
> >
> > "I proclaim that I am the Promised Messiah about whom every God's book has
> > prophecised that he will appear in the Last Days."
> > (Tohfa-e-Golravia, Roohani Khazain vol 17 p.295)
> >
> > "I swear upon that God, who has sent me and fabricating on Him is the work
> > of accursed one, He has sent me as Promised Massiah."
> > (Majmoo'a-e-Ishtiharaat vol 3 p.435)
> >
> > You see Farhan, how stepwise Mirza has progressed his claims. However the
> > biggest hurdle was the Hadith of Rasoolullah SAAW where He has repeatedly
> > mentioned the Messiah by name and his mother's name, always saying Eisa Ibne
> > Maryam or Maseeh Ibne Maryam. Can you think of any ways, how Mirza might
> > have over come this hurdle? Let me tell you:
> >
> > >From Mirza ibne Chiragh Bibi to Eisa ibne Maryam:
> > "God named me Maryam in the third part of Braheen-e-Ahmadiyya. Then as
> > evident by Braheen-e-Ahmadiyya,  for two years I grew as Maryam; then like
> > Maryam the soul of Jesus was breathed into me and I was made pregnant,
> > metaphorically, and after many months, which were not more than 10 months,
> > through inspiration, I was converted into Jesus. Thus, like this I became
> > Eisa ibne Maryam." (Kishtee-e-Nooh, Roohani Khazain vol 19 p. 87-89)
> >
> > Hmnnn..... life is becoming too complicated?
> >
> > Now let me make your life easier. Since every Qadiani believe in the
> > following:
> > 1. Eisa Ibne Maryam is dead
> > 2. He will not come back again.
> > 3. Someone else will take his place
> > 4. THAT someone is Mirza Ghulam
> >
> > Agreed?
> >
> > This means there is no use trying to discuss Khatam/life or death of Jesus.
> > Let us focus our attention on the man who is claiming that he is Jesus
> > re-incarnate. Let us scrutinize the character of the man who says that:
> >
> > "It has been revealed to me that this humble self in my Poverty and Humility
> > and Reliance on God and Sacrifices and According to Signs and Radiances, is
> > an exact replica of the first life of Maseeh; and this humble self's nature
> > and the nature of Maseeh resembles each other so much as if two pieces of
> > the same atom or two seeds of the same tree."
> > (Braheen-e-Ahmadiyya Part 3, Roohani Khazain vol 1 p.593)
> >
> > Now since it is the God who has revealed to Mirza that he is an exact
> > replica of Hazrat Eisa Ibne Maryam AS, let us see scrutinize the
> character
> > and life of Mirza Ghulam, how far it resembles that of Eisa AS.
> >
> > Wassalam
> >
> > Rashid
> > --
> > http://alhafeez.org/rashid/
> > [Verily in the Remembrance of Allah do hearts find Peace.(alQuran)]
> > email:  rasye-@emirates.net.ae 
> >         rasyed5-@hotmail.com 
> >
> >


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